Salsa City Forum » Salsa Music and Dance » Circles seem more natural than straight lines, also watch out for Frisbees!

The Salsa addict that I now am, decided to give John’s class at O’Neils a go for the first time on Monday night, at the expense of normally going to do my sporting activities.

When we started the beginners and I saw that I was the youngest in the class, and felt a bit out of place and thought, what have I let myself in for here?

I soon found out briefly chatting to a few of my partners is that John’s classes are orientated more to Cuban style (continuously moving in a circle) rather than New York style (along the wall).

Up until recently I had found the combinations of half turns, all a bit of a blur! However in the Improvers class John taught us a fairly long routine which included a combination of five continuous half turns with one low hand half turn for the guys. I was so surprised at how things seemed to flow even though the routine was completely new to me. I think it was made easier that I had a succession of more experienced partners helping me with the moves, but nevertheless it was as if someone had finally removed the spanner from the works in my head, and all the cogs started moving more freely, which was replicated by the moves we were doing.

The final move in the sequence was where the guy encourages the girl / lady to spin by gently flinging her left hand to his right and letting go. John noticed that one couple couldn’t quite get this right as the man (sorry for singling you out) was tending to follow his partner’s hand around her body, rather than flinging it out to the side.

John then showed the couple what they were doing wrong and then demonstrated how it should be done. Totally out of character for me, to come forward at this point and boldly suggest that the action was like throwing a Frisbee! John welcomed the suggestion and said we’ll call the move, ‘The Frisbee’ and then called it out in the routine along with the other preceding moves to enable us to all time things correctly. I think I’ve also seen another variation of this move where both partners spin on the spot in opposite directions simultaneously, I suppose you could call this ‘The Twin Frisbee’.

Things in the improvers had gone so well, I decided to carry on a give the intermediate class a go, as for once my mind didn’t feel overloaded. The routine in the intermediates included moving from side to side with our partners in opposite directions in a reverse hand hold and turning in a circle whilst side by side and changing positions.
When we came to do the warm down I was feeling more relaxed than I had ever done before at the end of a class and consequently the movement in my hips seemed a lot more fluid than usual.

Thanks, John I really enjoyed your classes. I’ll try to come again soon!

Thanks for the report, Dai. I think you characterisation of the difference between Cuban style and mambo style is a little overemphatic. You don’t have to dance mambo style “in a straight line”. It’s just that it’s slightly easier to dance the mambo style on a crowded dancefloor without encroaching on the space of other dancers. When there’s plenty of room you’re free to move around the floor and around your partner in both styles.

There’s no rule that says you can’t mix Cuban and CBL styles, but if you are trying to dance CBL it’s technically correct to dance in a straight line. It’s not just a matter of how much space you take up on the dancefloor: the ‘line’ is also a useful reference for both the man and the woman to align themselves to at the end of the move. Some women find it quite disorienting to go off line.

There’s no such thing as “technically correct” in a street dance, Tom. As implied in your first line. (That’s what’s known as “trying to have it both ways”.) The criterion is “acceptable to one’s partner” (and the dancers around you). You just have to look at experienced New York/mambo dancers dancing exhibition dances (the ultimate in having plenty of space) to see that “the line” is a very flexible concept.

Switching back to New York style last night at Cuba was not too much of a problem as many of the moves I had done at John’s class we did again in Andy’s class and it was useful to do them again so that I can hopefully now remember them for another time.

Yes Hugh, I can see why New York style is more suited when you are limited for space. In fact on during Sunday’s class at The Wharf, Andy said that each couple’s dance space was a line, but with a circle around it to enable you to both turn and change positions. I suppose you could relate this to the centre circle and halfway line on a football pitch although much smaller of course.

I appreciate your point Tom about coming back to the line or to a line, because it helps both partners to align themselves after a sequence of turns and half turns combinations, that could otherwise be disorientating for both if the sequence is too long.

I did try to practice a bit more last night at Cuba after the classes even if it was only for a couple of tracks and with only two partners. I tried to mix it up a bit as well! Sorry my timing wasn’t great, but thank you to both of my partners!

OK, “technically correct” is the wrong term (it’s not ballroom, thank goodness) - perhaps “usual” is a better way of putting it. Sticking to the line is what most experienced women CBL dancers will expect most of the time: they will find it more “acceptable”, and you will find them easier to dance with. The other advantage of trying to stick to the line is that it will help you develop precision and control.

There are indeed no rules in salsa except to have fun, listen to and interpret the music, dance with your partnernad connect with them.

Personally I love any style, on 1, on 2, cuban, whatever but to be honest it does bug me when people switch styles half way through as they are all very different and it means adapting to a new style constantly.

If its cuban, stay cuban, if its cross body, stay on the line.

I just wish there was more opportunity to learn cuban style and on 2 in cardiff, but never mind!

But mambo/cross-body style salsa has always contained elements of what is thought of as Cuban salsa. It’s just a matter of how well they are integrated.

Yes, you can incorporate versions of Cuban steps and moves into CBL salsa and obviously many common moves have a Cuban origin. But that’s not the same as switching between CBL and Cuban styles, which should have a very different feel to them.

Having said that, Lisa, I have to admit I do sometimes stick in a bit of what little Cuban salsa I know if it fits the music and the partner. But I don’t think I’ve done this with you as you dance CBL so well.

Of course CBL has elements of cuban salsa as cuban salsa is the original salsa but its far more flashy, fast and showy and not to mention has all those spins for a follower.

U do stick in cuban bits yes tom and thank you for the compliment... don’t get me wrong I love cuban salsa too and hadn’t really thought much about integrating them until I just went to spain on a salsa hol. A couple were dancing CBL but the leader then added a cuban break and the follwer replied ‘oh we’re daning cuban now?’

I think they are so different that its good to do either or personally but then everyone has their own unique style which is good too otherwise it would get boring. I guess as a follower we just have to follow what guy does.namely by following his hand all the time.